Car insurance question

[Spike]

My wife and I each own a car and have our own insurance policies. These are
due for renewal in the near future.

Our current insurers are taking the mickey with increases in the premiums,
which has led me to seek an alternative insurer. I have received an online
quote from a well-known source. On reviewing the quote the last question
posed was ‘Do you want to insure a second vehicle? You must be the policy
holder for both’. There is a discount for such an arrangement.

However, if I took up this offer, always assuming the approval of Senior
Management, what would happen to the policy for my wife’s car in the event
of my dying? The online chatbot was no help with this.

[Martin Brown]

Post by Spike
My wife and I each own a car and have our own insurance policies. These are
due for renewal in the near future.
Our current insurers are taking the mickey with increases in the premiums,
which has led me to seek an alternative insurer. I have received an online
quote from a well-known source. On reviewing the quote the last question
posed was ‘Do you want to insure a second vehicle? You must be the policy
holder for both’. There is a discount for such an arrangement.
However, if I took up this offer, always assuming the approval of Senior
Management, what would happen to the policy for my wife’s car in the event
of my dying? The online chatbot was no help with this.

The normal rule is that specific insurance for car and home dies with
the holder and any named drivers have to obtain their own insurance as a
priority. Insurers have to be notified of the death.

Some insurers will allow a transfer of the policy to a named spouse
driver but they may well charge a new driver premium if there is no
accumulated NCD. Others insist of a start from scratch basis.

You can very quickly get a cover note if you need to. But it is the sort
of thing that can easily catch out the unexpectedly bereaved spouse.

See for example:

https://www.bereavementadvice.org/topics/registering-a-death-and-informing-others/informing-insurance-on-homes-and-cars/

[billy bookcase]

Post by Spike
My wife and I each own a car and have our own insurance policies. These are
due for renewal in the near future.
Our current insurers are taking the mickey with increases in the premiums,
which has led me to seek an alternative insurer. I have received an online
quote from a well-known source. On reviewing the quote the last question
posed was 'Do you want to insure a second vehicle? You must be the policy
holder for both'. There is a discount for such an arrangement.
However, if I took up this offer, always assuming the approval of Senior
Management, what would happen to the policy for my wife's car in the event
of my dying? The online chatbot was no help with this.

The normal rule is that specific insurance for car and home dies with the
holder and any named drivers have to obtain their own insurance as a priority.
Insurers have to be notified of the death.

indeed.

Some insurers will allow a transfer of the policy to a named spouse driver but they may
well charge a new driver premium if there is no accumulated NCD. Others insist of a
start from scratch basis.

While others seem to take a much more "flexible" approach.

An enquiry in today's "Guardian"

quote:

My dad FH passed away in July, and, since then, I have been trying to
cancel his car insurance with Sainsbury's Bank. I wrote to explain the
situation, but it didn't act on the letter or scan his interim death
certificate.

When I managed to speak to someone, in mid-September, it promised to cancel
the policy and contact the underwriter to see if a refund could be backdated.

But, instead of cancelling, * I received a new one with his name amended to
include "executor of" in the middle.*

But, not to worry, the covering letter, addressed to Mr Executor Of, was
pleased to confirm there would be no additional cost. Apart from the name
change, all the personal details of this new policyholder were identical
to my late dad's.

I still haven't been able to cancel the policy. My dad's premium was
£1,920, so it is costing more than £5 a day, and we don't even have the
car any more

WP, Eastleigh, Hampshire

unquote:

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2024/nov/06/my-late-father-is-still-being-charged-for-car-insurance

Apparently Sainsbury's Bank make use a range of underwriters Action 365 Ltd t/a
Pukka Services · Ageas Insurance Ltd · AXA Insurance UK plc · Covea Insurance plc ·
ERS · Highway Insurance Company ...

https://www.sainsburysbank.co.uk/car-insurance/support/our-insurers

And add their own Sainsbury branding* so as to instil that extra feeling of
confidence and reassurance essential in products of this mature


bb

* Half of the cash self-checkouts in a largish Sainsbury were out of
action *again* today. Although it's not as if anyone would notice that
the price of 800g Mornflake Oatbran has jumped from £2.00 to £2.95
overnight, or anything.

[Martin Brown]

Post by billy bookcase

Post by Spike
My wife and I each own a car and have our own insurance policies. These are
due for renewal in the near future.
Our current insurers are taking the mickey with increases in the premiums,
which has led me to seek an alternative insurer. I have received an online
quote from a well-known source. On reviewing the quote the last question
posed was 'Do you want to insure a second vehicle? You must be the policy
holder for both'. There is a discount for such an arrangement.
However, if I took up this offer, always assuming the approval of Senior
Management, what would happen to the policy for my wife's car in the event
of my dying? The online chatbot was no help with this.

The normal rule is that specific insurance for car and home dies with the
holder and any named drivers have to obtain their own insurance as a priority.
Insurers have to be notified of the death.

indeed.

Some insurers will allow a transfer of the policy to a named spouse driver but they may
well charge a new driver premium if there is no accumulated NCD. Others insist of a
start from scratch basis.

While others seem to take a much more "flexible" approach.
An enquiry in today's "Guardian"
My dad FH passed away in July, and, since then, I have been trying to
cancel his car insurance with Sainsbury's Bank. I wrote to explain the
situation, but it didn't act on the letter or scan his interim death
certificate.

When things like this go wrong you are usually better off phoning them
and speaking directly to their bereavement team who should understand
the rules. This however is not guaranteed of generic call centre staff
or increasingly half baked AI bots. Be polite but firm. Keep good notes
of who you spoke to and when and then follow up with an email
summarising what you said and what they have promised to do.

Post by billy bookcase
When I managed to speak to someone, in mid-September, it promised to cancel
the policy and contact the underwriter to see if a refund could be backdated.
But, instead of cancelling, * I received a new one with his name amended to
include "executor of" in the middle.*
But, not to worry, the covering letter, addressed to Mr Executor Of, was
pleased to confirm there would be no additional cost. Apart from the name
change, all the personal details of this new policyholder were identical
to my late dad's.

In this case I'd take it to the R4 consumer programme "You & Yours" they
love stories like this and you will get it sorted out within hours once
Sainsbury's PR department get involved. It shouldn't be like this but
often it is. My biggest headache was with a private pension provider.

You should definitely be asking for compensation for the distress caused
by their inept handling of your letter and their actions arising from
it. You have the evidence so rattle the tree to see what falls out.

[Roland Perry]

Post by billy bookcase

The normal rule is that specific insurance for car and home dies with the
holder and any named drivers have to obtain their own insurance as a priority.
Insurers have to be notified of the death.

indeed.

Some insurers will allow a transfer of the policy to a named spouse driver but they may
well charge a new driver premium if there is no accumulated NCD. Others insist of a
start from scratch basis.

While others seem to take a much more "flexible" approach.

My wife passed away in January "after a long illness", and we had
already made enquiries about the car insurance (for the main family
car, which was in her name). They agreed to put it in my name and also
roll over the NCD - sensible anyway as I had been the only driver for
a couple of years.

The house insurance (it was on a multi-policy), however, they implacably
said would remain, in her name, until it expired at the end of its 12
months, and they refused to allow me to renew/rename it. They wanted to
start again from scratch. The result was that with, by then, two cars
and a house on a multi-policy, I was inclined to shop around, and now
have three separate policies with three different insurers.

The pet insurance was a disaster, because they specifically won't
transfer the policyholder, and of course that means they don't have
to honour their cost-fixed-for-life. With an ageing dog, a new policy
would be prohibitively expensive.

[Tim Jackson]

On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 08:52:48 +0000, Roland Perry wrote...

Post by Roland Perry
The house insurance (it was on a multi-policy), however, they implacably
said would remain, in her name, until it expired at the end of its 12
months, and they refused to allow me to renew/rename it.

If the house was in your wife's sole name, I suspect that initially that
would be the correct procedure. The house (and therefore the risk)
would lie with the executors of your wife's estate until transferred
elsewhere. If her will left the house to you, wouldn't there need to be
probate, followed by a formal transfer process to effect that? (Even
though the executor might also have been you.)

If you owned the house jointly, it should have been insured jointly.
Unless someone knows better, the correct procedure would then depend
whether you were "joint tenants" or "tenants in common". (Legal terms;
nothing to do with renting).

If tenants in common, you and your wife's estate would each own
(presumably) 50%. You would then need a formal transfer process as
above for her 50%.

Joint tenancy would be more usual for a husband and wife. I think the
whole property automatically becomes yours on your wife's death. But
the insurance company would probably want to see evidence of the joint
tenancy.

IANAL.

[Roland Perry]

Post by Tim Jackson
On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 08:52:48 +0000, Roland Perry wrote...

Post by Roland Perry
The house insurance (it was on a multi-policy), however, they implacably
said would remain, in her name, until it expired at the end of its 12
months, and they refused to allow me to renew/rename it.

If the house was in your wife's sole name, I suspect that initially that
would be the correct procedure.

Like everything else, in joint names.

Post by Tim Jackson
The house (and therefore the risk)
would lie with the executors of your wife's estate until transferred
elsewhere. If her will left the house to you, wouldn't there need to be
probate, followed by a formal transfer process to effect that? (Even
though the executor might also have been you.)

As she had no discernible assets in her sole name, no need for probate.
We did everything 'together'.

Post by Tim Jackson
If you owned the house jointly, it should have been insured jointly.

Oh, that's not something any insurance company ever offered. Ditto car
insurance - they wanted one name on the policy and the other to be a
named driver.

Post by Tim Jackson
Unless someone knows better, the correct procedure would then depend
whether you were "joint tenants" or "tenants in common". (Legal terms;
nothing to do with renting).
If tenants in common, you and your wife's estate would each own
(presumably) 50%. You would then need a formal transfer process as
above for her 50%.
Joint tenancy would be more usual for a husband and wife. I think the
whole property automatically becomes yours on your wife's death.

Indeed.

Post by Tim Jackson
But the insurance company would probably want to see evidence of the
joint tenancy.

The Land Registry had recorded that information.

No insurance company ever asked to see it (for any of the nine houses we
owned in 35yrs - yes, we moved a lot, and paid far too much Stamp Duty,
AKA relocation tax, as a result).

[Handsome Jack]

Post by Roland Perry

Post by Tim Jackson
On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 08:52:48 +0000, Roland Perry wrote...

Post by Roland Perry
The house insurance (it was on a multi-policy), however, they
implacably said would remain, in her name, until it expired at the end
of its 12 months, and they refused to allow me to renew/rename it.

If the house was in your wife's sole name, I suspect that initially that
would be the correct procedure.

Like everything else, in joint names.

Post by Tim Jackson
The house (and therefore the risk)
would lie with the executors of your wife's estate until transferred
elsewhere. If her will left the house to you, wouldn't there need to be
probate, followed by a formal transfer process to effect that? (Even
though the executor might also have been you.)

As she had no discernible assets in her sole name, no need for probate.
We did everything 'together'.

Post by Tim Jackson
If you owned the house jointly, it should have been insured jointly.

Oh, that's not something any insurance company ever offered. Ditto car
insurance - they wanted one name on the policy and the other to be a
named driver.

My home insurer (Aviva) has my name (Jack Jones, say) entered in the
"Policyholder" field in the "Summary of Cover". But it addresses
correspondence to "Mr Jack Jones and Mrs Jill Jones", and in the
"Information provided by you" document it states "Policyholder(s): Mr
Jack Jones and Mrs Jill Jones".

I can't imagine this means anything other than that we are joint and equal
policyholders, while I am named as the main contact merely for
correspondence purposes. We have joint bank accounts with a similar
arrangement. I agree the situation is less clear for motor insurance.

Sorry for your loss BTW.

[Martin Brown]

Post by Handsome Jack

Post by Roland Perry

Post by Tim Jackson
On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 08:52:48 +0000, Roland Perry wrote...

Post by Roland Perry
The house insurance (it was on a multi-policy), however, they
implacably said would remain, in her name, until it expired at the end
of its 12 months, and they refused to allow me to renew/rename it.

If the house was in your wife's sole name, I suspect that initially that
would be the correct procedure.

Like everything else, in joint names.

Post by Tim Jackson
The house (and therefore the risk)
would lie with the executors of your wife's estate until transferred
elsewhere. If her will left the house to you, wouldn't there need to be
probate, followed by a formal transfer process to effect that? (Even
though the executor might also have been you.)

As she had no discernible assets in her sole name, no need for probate.
We did everything 'together'.

Post by Tim Jackson
If you owned the house jointly, it should have been insured jointly.

Oh, that's not something any insurance company ever offered. Ditto car
insurance - they wanted one name on the policy and the other to be a
named driver.

My home insurer (Aviva) has my name (Jack Jones, say) entered in the
"Policyholder" field in the "Summary of Cover". But it addresses
correspondence to "Mr Jack Jones and Mrs Jill Jones", and in the
"Information provided by you" document it states "Policyholder(s): Mr
Jack Jones and Mrs Jill Jones".

You only ever find out who are the most obstreperous and incompetent
organisations after the event. To be fair most organisations have a
dedicated and helpful team of bereavement advisors but the ones that
don't can be hell to deal with.

My brother-in-law still gets gas bills for Executor(s) of his mum and
after about half a dozen attempts to get it changed has now given up.
The company doesn't care so long as it gets paid and he isn't keen on
changing suppliers just to sort the issue out.

Post by Handsome Jack
I can't imagine this means anything other than that we are joint and equal
policyholders, while I am named as the main contact merely for
correspondence purposes. We have joint bank accounts with a similar
arrangement. I agree the situation is less clear for motor insurance.

It may be like with Building Society accounts where the exact order of
the names on the account/contract is significant. First one being "it".

[Roland Perry]

Post by Handsome Jack

Post by Roland Perry

Post by Tim Jackson
On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 08:52:48 +0000, Roland Perry wrote...

Post by Roland Perry
The house insurance (it was on a multi-policy), however, they
implacably said would remain, in her name, until it expired at the end
of its 12 months, and they refused to allow me to renew/rename it.

If the house was in your wife's sole name, I suspect that initially that
would be the correct procedure.

Like everything else, in joint names.

Post by Tim Jackson
The house (and therefore the risk)
would lie with the executors of your wife's estate until transferred
elsewhere. If her will left the house to you, wouldn't there need to be
probate, followed by a formal transfer process to effect that? (Even
though the executor might also have been you.)

As she had no discernible assets in her sole name, no need for probate.
We did everything 'together'.

Post by Tim Jackson
If you owned the house jointly, it should have been insured jointly.

Oh, that's not something any insurance company ever offered. Ditto car
insurance - they wanted one name on the policy and the other to be a
named driver.

My home insurer (Aviva) has my name (Jack Jones, say) entered in the
"Policyholder" field in the "Summary of Cover". But it addresses
correspondence to "Mr Jack Jones and Mrs Jill Jones", and in the
"Information provided by you" document it states "Policyholder(s): Mr
Jack Jones and Mrs Jill Jones".
I can't imagine this means anything other than that we are joint and equal
policyholders, while I am named as the main contact merely for
correspondence purposes. We have joint bank accounts with a similar
arrangement. I agree the situation is less clear for motor insurance.
Sorry for your loss BTW.

Thanks. We had a good life together, but it ended too soon. Almost 30yrs
ago, discussing moderated usenet (I'm in the background):

[JNugent]

Post by Roland Perry

Post by Handsome Jack

Post by Roland Perry

Post by Tim Jackson
On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 08:52:48 +0000, Roland Perry wrote...

Post by Roland Perry
The house insurance (it was on a multi-policy), however, they
implacably said would remain, in her name, until it expired at the end
of its 12 months, and they refused to allow me to renew/rename it.

If the house was in your wife's sole name, I suspect that initially that
would be the correct procedure.

Like everything else, in joint names.

Post by Tim Jackson
The house (and therefore the risk)
would lie with the executors of your wife's estate until transferred
elsewhere.  If her will left the house to you, wouldn't there need
to be
probate, followed by a formal transfer process to effect that?  (Even
though the executor might also have been you.)

As she had no discernible assets in her sole name, no need for probate.
We did everything 'together'.

Post by Tim Jackson
If you owned the house jointly, it should have been insured jointly.

Oh, that's not something any insurance company ever offered. Ditto car
insurance - they wanted one name on the policy and the other to be a
named driver.

My home insurer (Aviva) has my name (Jack Jones, say) entered in the
"Policyholder" field in the "Summary of Cover". But it addresses
correspondence to "Mr Jack Jones and Mrs Jill Jones", and in the
"Information provided by you" document it states "Policyholder(s): Mr
Jack Jones and Mrs Jill Jones".
I can't imagine this means anything other than that we are joint and equal
policyholders, while I am named as the main contact merely for
correspondence purposes. We have joint bank accounts with a similar
arrangement. I agree the situation is less clear for motor insurance.
Sorry for your loss BTW.

Thanks. We had a good life together, but it ended too soon. Almost 30yrs
http://youtu.be/SWKEST8ZR0s

I was sorry to hear of this and for your obvious great loss.

[Tim Jackson]

On Mon, 11 Nov 2024 08:59:19 -0000 (UTC), Handsome Jack wrote...

Post by Handsome Jack
My home insurer (Aviva) has my name (Jack Jones, say) entered in the
"Policyholder" field in the "Summary of Cover". But it addresses
correspondence to "Mr Jack Jones and Mrs Jill Jones", and in the
"Information provided by you" document it states "Policyholder(s): Mr
Jack Jones and Mrs Jill Jones".

My confirmation of renewal (with LV=) is addressed to me, but lists both
me and my wife under "Personal Details" and says that she is a joint
policyholder. As I recall, when I originally took the policy out, their
proposal form specifically asked for details of any joint owner.

[JNugent]

Post by Spike
My wife and I each own a car and have our own insurance policies. These are
due for renewal in the near future.
Our current insurers are taking the mickey with increases in the premiums,
which has led me to seek an alternative insurer. I have received an online
quote from a well-known source. On reviewing the quote the last question
posed was ‘Do you want to insure a second vehicle? You must be the policy
holder for both’. There is a discount for such an arrangement.
However, if I took up this offer, always assuming the approval of Senior
Management, what would happen to the policy for my wife’s car in the event
of my dying? The online chatbot was no help with this.

The policy won't transfer with title to the vehicle. That's a risk you
have to calculate.

My tip: try GA online.

My premium (fully comp) with them went up from £213 t0 £219 earlier this
year.

Best of luck.

[Brian]

Post by Spike
My wife and I each own a car and have our own insurance policies. These are
due for renewal in the near future.
Our current insurers are taking the mickey with increases in the premiums,
which has led me to seek an alternative insurer. I have received an online
quote from a well-known source. On reviewing the quote the last question
posed was ‘Do you want to insure a second vehicle? You must be the policy
holder for both’. There is a discount for such an arrangement.
However, if I took up this offer, always assuming the approval of Senior
Management, what would happen to the policy for my wife’s car in the event
of my dying? The online chatbot was no help with this.

There is another potential problem with some multi car policies.

We were with a Company which offered a multi car discount ( at the time we
had 4 vehicles, 3 cars and a motorhome) which at first looked attractive
for the cars. They didn’t even require all the cars to be insured in one
name. ( Motorhomes tend to be best insured with specialists.)

The problem was, only one could have protected NCD in effect. Even if, say,
I had a claim, the protection on Senior Management’s policy would be lost-
even if the policies were in different names. As all three policies had max
NCD, protected, this was an issue.

I don’t recall the company - this was several years ago and we changed when
we changed cars.

[Spike]

Post by Spike
My wife and I each own a car and have our own insurance policies. These are
due for renewal in the near future.
Our current insurers are taking the mickey with increases in the premiums,
which has led me to seek an alternative insurer. I have received an online
quote from a well-known source. On reviewing the quote the last question
posed was ‘Do you want to insure a second vehicle? You must be the policy
holder for both’. There is a discount for such an arrangement.
However, if I took up this offer, always assuming the approval of Senior
Management, what would happen to the policy for my wife’s car in the event
of my dying? The online chatbot was no help with this.

Many thanks to those who replied. The information given was interesting; I
was aware of the non-transfer of such an insurance policy on death, but did
wonder how the particular insurer would handle the issue. Their chatbot was
not helpful, hence my query here. The experiences of NCD holders was also
illustrative of the sort of problems that can arise with multi-vehicle
policies, as was the issue with the well-known supermarket insurer.

I had obtained a quote a week or two ago, and was in the process of signing
up when this option appeared at the very bottom of the page. I felt it was
worth exploring but their AI wasn’t particularly ‘I’ IYSWIM.

The quoted premium is about 15% lower than my current insurer, whose 50%
rise last year I reluctantly accepted due to other pressures. Mrs Spike is
in a similar situation to me in regard to renewal, and she will be changing
insurers too, but not to a multi-vehicle policy.

So, thanks once again to all for the helpful information.

[Jack Harry Teesdale]

Post by Spike
My wife and I each own a car and have our own insurance policies. These are
due for renewal in the near future.
Our current insurers are taking the mickey with increases in the premiums,
which has led me to seek an alternative insurer. I have received an online
quote from a well-known source. On reviewing the quote the last question
posed was ‘Do you want to insure a second vehicle? You must be the policy
holder for both’. There is a discount for such an arrangement.
However, if I took up this offer, always assuming the approval of Senior
Management, what would happen to the policy for my wife’s car in the event
of my dying? The online chatbot was no help with this.

You can get 'multi-car'policies with some insurance companies which may
sole your dilemna.